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The Rediff Interview/ Sitaram Kesri

'Party members feel less confident under Sonia'

Enter "Chacha" Sitaram Kesri's Purana Qila Road residence in New Delhi and you can't help comparing the past with the present.

Time was when groups of hangers-on outside his residence were a permanent fixture. Television cameras were always whirring with reporters asking endless questions, as and when Kesri made a brief appearance to exchange pleasantries.

All that is history.

His residence wears a forlorn, deserted look now. The sole uniformed guard wearing a bored expression on his face waves you in, indicating that there are few people who have sought an appointment with the former Congress chief.

You glance around. There is not even one car parked outside.

"Aap baithiye, Chacha abhi aayenge," (please take your seat, Chacha will come) says a lad who hands me a glass of water.

Barring the whirring of the fan above, there is silence. The roar of an occasional passing car outside distracts your attention from the fact that Chacha is indeed leading a 'retired' life.

But is he? Media reports continue to say that Kesri continues to needle his successor, Congress chief Sonia Gandhi, in a reported bid to get the better of her.

You are ushered into the adjoining room. The dhoti-clad Chacha enters pulling a crumpled cotton kurta over his head.

"Bahar chaliye, bahar thankdak hai," (let's go outside, it is cooler there) he says. The lad quickly drags two cane chairs to the lawn.

"Jaldi kijiyega, mai aajkal thak jata hoon," (be brief, I tire easily) he cautions and sits back.

Excerpts from an exclusive interview with Tara Shankar Sahay.

So you have not been considered for a Rajya Sabha nomination by Congress chief Sonia Gandhi. After about three decades in the Upper House of Parliament, how does it feel to be left out now?

Unki marzi hai ( it is their wish ).

Whom are you talking about? Are you referring to Sonia Gandhi?

(Silence.)

So you are reconciled to the Congress' Rajya Sabha nominations?

They have done it in their wisdom. And they have to face the consequences.

Please don't be vague. Why don't you speak out?

I don't have to speak out. There are younger party members who feel disenchanted.

I see party members feeling less confident under the present leadership because there is a drift and sense of helplessness.

Leadership has to be made of sterner stuff. If you are not decisive, if you are seen vacillating and in two minds, party members know that the person at the top is not fully confident that he or she enjoys their support, their confidence.

How was your tenure as party chief different from that of Sonia?

I acted decisively on whatever I undertook. I was not afraid of the challenges facing the party and I tackled them to the best of my capability.

A leader need not be necessarily brilliant or an intellectual. But he or she has to have a plenty of horse-sense, must be able to read the political climate and fashion his strategy accordingly, instead of dithering and sending out the wrong signals.

During the Calcutta plenary session of the party, I initiated some steps which I felt were in the party's interests.

Like our secular values, for instance. I denied a Lok Sabha ticket to one of our party leaders because I was convinced that he did not take sufficient steps to prevent the demolition of the Babri Masjid when he was in a position to do so. I did not hesitate to call a spade a spade.

Now that your party's Rajya Sabha nominations have been announced, do you think that dissidence in the Congress would rise?

Main bhavishyavani nahin karta hoon (I don't predict the future). But I have told you that there is some disenchantment among young Congress leaders. It is up to the leadership to take cognisance of it.

But you too are a former party chief. Why don't you help the present party chief in solving some of the problems facing the party?

Sitaram Kesri is always there. He will help out if he is asked to help out. But my cooperation is always there.

You belong to Bihar. What has been your role in your party's decision to share power with the Rabri Devi government?

Considering that the decision was a collective party decision, I was also instrumental in taking it. But I can give more guidance on matters pertaining to the state not only because I belong to it but as I have half a century of political experience.

Our party first opposed the RJD and then has an alliance with it now. There has to be consistency in our decisions. Otherwise I am afraid things have a tendency to have a reverse effect.

You are considered a friend of Rashtriya Janata Dal chief Laloo Prasad Yadav. Do you think he will live up to his promise that he would work for the creation of a Jharkhand state?

Whatever be the inclinations of Laloo Yadav, our leadership must ensure that the RJD-Congress alliance does not boomerang on us. Otherwise, allegations will start floating again that our leadership did not know what it was doing. Bihar is an important state where the Congress can recover much of its glory if we take the right path.

To Congress veterans like you and P V Narasimha Rao, what does the denial of Rajya Sabha nominations mean?

Speaking for myself, I am a Congressman and will remain so till my death. But I have seen leaders come and go. I think the party will survive, whatever happens.

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