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The Rediff Interview/ Kashmir DGP Gurbachan Jagat

'If they have doubts about the encounter they can ask for exhuming the bodies'

Gurbachan Jagat, director general of the Jammu and Kashmir police, has led the force for the last three years under the most difficult circumstances. Not an hour passes by when he does not get bad news from some part of the valley or the other. The massacre of 35 Sikhs in Chatti Singhpora on March 20 was one such incident that sent shock waves all over the country.

The security agencies had barely got a breather when some residents of Anantnag accused the state police and other security agencies of killing five innocent people in an encounter and dubbing them as militants responsible for the Chatti Singhpora massacre.

In an interview with rediff.com's Onkar Singh, Jagat explained that the state administration has no objection if the court wants the bodies of the people killed in the encounter to be exhumed.

What kind of security arrangements have you made for Sikhs living in the valley after the Chatti Singhpora massacre?

We have identified 115 villages where Sikh families live in the valley. In all, the Sikh population in Srinagar is in the vicinity of 45,000 people. We have put up pickets at all these places. The strength of the picket depends upon the number of people living in the villages. Right now, these pickets are being manned by the J&K police. Later, we plan to strengthen them with the induction of some para-military forces.

So you are not involving the army in this task?

No. If you go back ten years you would find that the army has not been involved in this kind of work. They have a clear cut role in protecting the borders of the country. We, of course, take the help of the Indian army as and when it is required.

Were you taken aback by the gruesome incident at Chatti Singhpora?

The government at the highest level has already stated that we never had any information that Sikhs would be attacked by the militants because in the past they never had any trouble. They had been living in the valley for ten years without any problems. So we did not apprehend that there would be any trouble.

Is it true that a delegation of Sikhs from the village had met the Union home minister and told him about their fears? The home minister, in turn, directed the state administration to take steps to ensure their security.

How can I answer this question? Only the Union home minister can tell us whether a delegation of Sikhs from the village had met him or not. As far as the state administration is concerned nothing was ever conveyed to us -- that Sikhs from the village were under threat from the militants.

In fact, a delegation of Sikhs met Chief Minister Farooq Abdullah three days before the incident. They discussed everything -- roads, drinking water and other facilities in the village. They did not mention any danger to them.

But we have reports saying the local administration was aware of their security worries.

I too heard about it. But I have checked up with my SSP, Anantnag, who is a very efficient police officer and he told me that the villagers had never approached him for security. I also checked up with IG Kashmir Zone Ashok Bhatt as well. He was also not approached by anyone.

Let me tell you that since I joined the J&K police as director general in 1997, I have always asked the villagers to form village defence committees or become special police officers. They have refused firearms on one pretext or the other.

Why? Did they think they would be more vulnerable if they joined the village defence committees?

I cannot tell you what the villagers felt. I think they felt they were safe. They had some sort of arrangement with the militants whereby they felt there was no danger to them.

Is it true that the villagers knew the militants?

Subsequent investigations conducted by us after the incident clearly indicated that the militants had been visiting Chatti Singhpora in the last few weeks. They had known them. That is how Mohammad Wagaye was identified by the villagers because he was accompanying the militants who executed 35 Sikhs.

Some people from Anantnag district have gone to court, alleging that five innocent people were killed by paramilitary forces in fake encounters and they have been branded as militants. There were reports that you have been asked to investigate the matter by the chief minister.

No, I have not been asked to conduct any investigation by the chief minister. The chief judicial magistrate has appointed an inquiry officer. Since the matter is now before the court I would not like to say anything on this matter.

Since you have had the opportunity to combat terrorism both in Punjab as well as in Jammu and Kashmir, how would you compare the militancy in the two states?

There are some basic differences. Number one is the terrain. In Punjab we had plain area and there was no difficulty in moving about in the state and chasing the militants. In Jammu and Kashmir we have to deal with militants who hide themselves in the mountains and thick jungles.

Punjab had a very clear border and once it was fenced we did not have much of a problem and there was no infiltration. In Jammu and Kashmir we do not have any clear cut border. The Line of Control is irregular and it is not possible to fence it. Then we have mountains all along the LoC.

The Punjab militancy was a local affair and there were various other causes for the anger of the youth. Once these causes were taken care of, the local militancy died down naturally. There was no involvement of foreign mercenaries in that movement. Whereas, in Jammu and Kashmir, Pakistani interference is much high. The stakes are very high.

When in 1998 the local militancy had almost died down, Pakistan started inducting foreign mercenaries in the valley. These elements, namely Afghans, and Pakistanis, are sustaining militancy in the state. These mercenaries have much better training and weapons.

Do you think the hijacking of Flight 814 has boosted militancy in the valley?

No, I don't think so. The militancy was the same before and after the hijacking.

What have you done to restore the confidence of the Sikh villagers?

I wouldn't say they are feeling any better because they have lost a large number of members of their community. We have set up pickets in each and every village where the Sikhs live. Then we ensure that these villages have regular patrolling. Senior officers keep visiting these places from time to time to ensure that everything is in place.

But over and above, what is needed is that we should continue our anti-insurgency operations in these places so that we keep getting more and more militants during these operations. The main group operating in these villages is the Lashkar-e-Toiba.

People from neighbouring villages have visited Chatti Singhpora and expressed their solidarity with them. They have asked the Sikhs to continue living here. Political leaders like Omar Farooq and Shabir Shah have visited the village and expressed their solidarity with the villagers.

Omar Farooq claims he was placed under house arrest and the administration prevented him from visiting the village.

This is not correct. He visited the village a few days before the bhog ceremony on March 31. We would not stop anyone from visiting this place if the objective is to encourage communal harmony.

Do you think the Sikhs will still migrate to other parts of the country?

Some of the statements were made initially when the Sikh community was emotionally charged. Since then, tempers have cooled down and the sense of insecurity has also come down considerably. Visits by leading Sikh leaders like Punjab Chief Minister Parkash Singh Badal, Simranjit Singh Mann and Gurcharan Singh Tohra, MPs, also helped in easing our task quite a bit.

What is the situation in Anantnag now? When will it improve?

We have told the people from this district that if they have any doubts about the encounter in which five militants were killed they can ask for exhuming the bodies. They can go in for DNA and fingerprinting tests anywhere in India. We would do everything to set their doubts to rest.

In the second encounter, they said four Gujjars were missing. Later these people came back to their homes and it was found that they were working as guides with the security forces. They reached their homes after the encounter. To be on the safe side we took receipts from members of their families that they had reached home.

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