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'I told the aviation secretary 'Don't destroy Air-India by making it fly all these uneconomical routes'

In this interview with Sundaymagazine editor Vir Sanghvi, Chand Mahal Ibrahim spoke with a rare candour.

No doubt you think 23 is a good cut-off age.

(Laughs) I have discussed it with the cabin crew union and said we will give them ground jobs. My suggestion is that we should only hire air-hostesses on a contract for five or six years as a cut-off date. You give them good training and pick up the good-looking ones.

So, P C Sen is going to the next chairman of both airlines.

Yes. I have sent the proposal. It should be announced by the time his appears in print. He will be chairman and managing director of Indian Airlines and chairman of Air-India.

We will do it on a temporary basis till the new board is constituted. And then he will get a full term till 1999.

Why did you appoint him?

I feel he is an honest officer. He is one who has always brought things that need to be rectified to my notice. I like that quality. He works with a team spirit. He is able to motivate a team and get good results from them. He knows the subject and how to handle problems.

Do you know how much lobbying there was for the job? But because I wanted to be sure of P C Sen, I went to Bhopal to look at all the records of his service in the Madhya Pradesh IAS cadre. He was so effective in finishing the excise mafia in Madhya Pradesh that I almost thought, 'Never mind the airlines, let us bring him to Karnataka. He will finish off our excise mafia here'.

All of Air-India's problems will end because there will be a good man at the head.

Air-India does have a good man as managing director.

Yes, yes. We have to take a decision.

What about the new board?

We will have people who will contribute: engineers, businessman, people from tourism, a comprehensive board.

Who will you retain?

I can't answer that question.

Do you have a revival plan for Air India?

Air-India's problems is that it needs money. You have to pump Rs 10 billion or even Rs 15 billion into the airline. If you don't pump money, then things will not improve.

Where will you find the money?

Air-India already has the assets. It owns the Hotel Corporation of India which runs two good properties in Bombay, it has a hotel in Delhi and there is one more in Srinagar.

There is no reason for Air-India to get into the business or running hotels. It shouldn't have done so to begin with. So, my view is that we should just sell the hotels. If we privatise the Hotel Corporation, then we will find the money.

Who should run airport hotels according to you?

It shouldn't be Air-India. That's why we are selling the Centaurs. But the whole business should be looked at in a comprehensive manner. Let the private sector invest in airports. And to help them recover their investment, I will let them run duty-free shops and I will give them the land so that they can run an airport hotel also. That way, the airport and the hotel are part of the same package. So, there is some return for the investor.

Well, the Airports Authority seems to have come to the same conclusion on its own at Bombay airport.

(Laughs) You mean the Leela thing? No, no. That is totally wrong; we have told the CBI to take action against all the officials involved.

Once you pump money into Air-India what will you do?

Number one, we have to change the aircraft. Many of them are too old.

Number two, we have to have a rationalisation of routes. Air-India operates on too many uneconomical routes and not enough on economical routes like the Middle-East and the Far East. Now there is a demand for the CIS countries.

But Air-India is not so interested all this. They want to fly to all European and American routes. They don't want to cut lossmaking routes.

Would you make them reduce European flights?

My secretary says, 'Sir, we are a national carrier, we have to fly the national flag.' I don't agree. This is not the way to do it.

This has led to misunderstandings between me and my secretary.

I told him, 'If you want to fly the national flag, then buy a small building and put up a flag-pole over there. Don't destroy Air India by making it fly all these uneconomical routes.'

My view is that it is cheaper to buy property abroad than to destroy your national carrier by loading it with these losses.

When is Air India going to decide on the Medium Capacity Long Range aircraft?

It is such a controversial matter. If we had purchased it five years ago, we would have saved Rs 10 billion. But because of indecision we have lost the opportunity.

When I first came, I was very eager to get the decision taken. Immediately the papers started writing: Why is the minister in such a great hurry to put it through? They were trying to suggest that I had something to gain.

So I advised the board that the normal procedure should be followed. And the result is that no decision has been taken till yet.

Can you run an airline on this basis?

That is the system in this country. Any commercial decision takes so long that the commercial viability is affected. If you try and get them to hurry up. First they will say that you have something to gain. And then the people who are supposed to take the decision will feel frightened that an enquiry will be launched against them.

I gather Airbus is not the favourite.

I have heard that discussions are going in favour of Airbus also. But I am not going to take any part in this decision. There are committees, let them decide.

How committed are you to the present form of the Broadcasting Bill?

I am open to all suggestions. I am not at all committed to the present draft.

So far, we do not have any law on broadcasting. All channels are coming in without our permission. People are blaming me that I am showing obscenity.

Kind courtesy: Sunday magazine

C M Ibrahim interview, continued